Out of all the cast members on The Circle season 4, Yu Ling Wu’s journey was perhaps the most dramatic. After not making a great first impression, she let her big personality shine, soaring from the bottom to the top of the ratings. Along the way, she found herself in with multiple groups, including an alliance with Frank Grimsley and Rachel Evans, as well as a “throuple” with Josh “Bru” Brubaker and Alyssa Ljubicich. But things came to a head for the fire-haired Yu Ling during a surprise safety chain, as she was forced to pick between her two alliances. She ultimately went with the “Inner Circle,” which led to Alyssa’s surprise blocking, but successfully got her to the finale. Unfortunately, once she got there, Yu Ling, much like her stature, came up short, finishing in third place. Read on to hear Yu Ling’s thoughts on her time in the game. And check out Parade.com throughout The Circle season 4 with the various players and catfishes alike. What made you decide to enter The Circle? You know, it’s so funny. I had never watched The Circle, nor heard of The Circle, until April or May of 2021. Last year, I had like gone home. And my sister and brother-in-law were like, “Oh my God, do you know this show the Circle? It’s a social media competition. And you’re always on social media. You’d be so good at it.” And I was like, “Okay, sure.” So I watched the first season. And obviously, the first season was extremely successful. And I was like, “Yeah, that was fun. I like that.” So I watched the second season as well. Then they said, “The applications are open. You should apply.” And I was like, “Me on a reality TV show? I don’t know.” They’re like, “No, give it a go. Just try it.” It took them weeks and weeks of sending me the application every single week without fail. (Laughs.) At that time, I was freelancing. And, I think everyone kind of gets to the point where they’re burnt out with their job. Sorry to all the clients that might read this! (Laughs.) But I was burned out. And I thought, “You know what? I’m going to keep doing this thing to pay the bills. But it’ll be fun just to toss my name into the hat.” I never thought it was actually going to happen. But then I got a text back the next day that was like, “We saw your application. We’d love to continue the conversation.” And after a couple of months of back and forth, it just kind of happened. Did you ever contemplate going in as a catfish rather than yourself? It was pretty much Yu Ling or nothing. I had a hot second where I was like, “What if I can catfish as my mom?” Because that would be hilarious. I’ve written a lot about her; she’s a character in a lot of my work. But at some point, I was like, “That doesn’t make sense. I don’t want to do that. It has to be me.” And if anything, I’m already a bit of a character. I felt like my biggest fear was people were going to think I was a catfish if I went in because I’m so much that people might think it’s fake. So it was like Yu Ling or nothing at that point. Let’s start with where things finished. What was your reaction to finishing third in the finale? It was a little bit of a surprise. I was thinking I would place a little bit higher, given that I felt like I had this really bulletproof alliance with Frank and Rachel. And I thought if we were to rate each other, we would just knock down everybody else, so no matter what, we’d be the top three in whatever formation. I think actually headed into the final, I was actually not as confident. Only because with the other two in Eversen and Imani/Trevor, I realized I haven’t really gotten to talk to them in a very, very good way. So I was like, “Huh, it’s possible that they could rate me really low.” And that’s exactly what happened, and it balanced out to put me in the middle. What were your final ratings between the other four finalists? Frank was my first, and then I rated Rachel second. I rated Imani third and Everson last because I didn’t get a chance to talk to him. On his way out, Alex did warn you that Frank was a major threat to win. It’s clear you didn’t rate based on that, but did you give any consideration to possibly rating Frank at the bottom to give yourself a better chance of winning? When you make it to the final, obviously, everyone wants to win the $150,000. But I also think you think about who you think deserves this outside of yourself. And what a hard thing to do! Because everyone could use that amount of money in some way or another. And I’m sure everyone’s story would just bring you to tears. But at that point, I was like, “You know what? The one person that I know their story well enough, who’s helped me throughout this game, is Frank. I’m just going to vote with my heart.” Y’all can play strategy. But I made it to the end. And that’s all that matters. Let’s stick with Frank, who turns out to be one of your most important relationships this season. What made you decide to stick with him the entire time? He’s so warm. With his energy, you just gravitate towards it. He’s just super nice throughout the whole game, has lots of personality, and is just very uplifting. But he had a lot of moments on the show where he was more vulnerable. He shared a lot about himself, his story, and how he got there. For me, even if it was all digital, and you never met that person, there was something that felt so genuine and authentic about him. He is someone who is sure about his decisions and his choices. So if you’re on his good side, there’s nothing to worry about. He’s confident in you. And he says what he means. A lot of people will say that they mean a certain thing, but they’re just playing the game. With Frank, I truly believed that he meant what he said. Your season actually started with you being rated low, and some people tell you that you need to open up more in chats. Did that surprise you, given what you said before about being a big personality? That was the most shocking. I was really perplexed. Some of the social media conversations that I’ve seen about the show are people asking me, “Why do people think you’re shy? Because you’re so loud and obnoxious.” And…correct! (Laughs.) I am. I mean, obviously, in real life, I’m not always shouting 24/7. There are cameras on me. You have to put on a show. We can’t act like we’re sleeping or no one wants to watch us. Simultaneously, I felt I had to come across as a big character to the other players. So if I don’t play the big character, people are going to be like, “What’s going on? What’s happening?” So I felt like, “Okay, we need to play it up.” So they understand that I am who I say that I am. And once I give them more of myself, I can scale it back. Because now you know that I am this person. Let’s talk about some of the other relationships you made. You flirted a lot with Alex as Nathan throughout his time in the game. Did that surprise you? Yeah. I was not anticipating flirting with anybody, but I wasn’t closed off to it. If that means I get further in the game, so be it. I also knew in a sense that the nature of my and Nathan’s relationship was that we were going to flirt with each other. We’re just flirting. It’s harmless. We’re just saying these things. But I think maybe the downfall of that is that because we were so casual with it, we never got a chance to talk strategy. We never really fully got to be like, “Okay, we got each other.” Moving on to Bru, you were part of the “throuple” with him and Alyssa. But you do say at one point that you don’t know how to feel about him because he’s too neutral. Talk to me about those constantly changing feelings about him. Originally I thought Bru was a catfish. I did not recognize Bru. I know that he has like 4 million followers now on TikTok. But at the same time, I feel like a sweet man is a red flag. (Laughs.) So immediately, I was like, “I don’t know about that.” He was so laid back and sweet that it sounded fake. Then the virus blocking happened. And I was like, “Oh no, he’s mad. But he is a real person. He feels emotions.” It’s hard sometimes to tell whether or not somebody is opening up as part of strategy. Even in moments where he was being a little bit more sensitive and open with me, you’re still kind of like, “Is this just part of the game?” But his reaction was so strong to the virus blocking that I knew he was real. And I’ll admit it didn’t go the way I expected it to go. We both messed things up. And we’re like, “Oh, no. How did we do that?!” We’re the meme of all the Spider-Men pointing at each other. And it’s then I realized Bru was who he said he was. You have the opposite trajectory with Carol, AKA John. You’re in tight with her in the beginning. But things culminate in you two going after each other in a chat, and it’s clear that you wanted to get rid of him by the end of his game. How did that relationship change? I was so loyal to Carol. I even blocked Crissa for her. Even though Crissa, for me was such a heart connection, I was like, “I can’t say that we’ve shaken hands. I need to go with someone who saved me.” But I learned the same day that Carol also told Alyssa that she protected me at the first blocking. And when I learned that Carol was out here saying, “I saved each of you” to everyone, I was like, “Bro, what the hell is that? That’s strategic as hell. That’s such a lie. You two people were in that room. So when you say, ‘I saved you,’ that’s also saying Frank did not.” I didn’t like that she said that to multiple people. That, to me, is a red flag. And then the whole conversation around her being a catfish started to really bubble up. And I didn’t really mind that she was a catfish. We were almost like, “Yep, that’s catfish Carol!” (Laughs.) But at some point, you’re like, “If she’s loyal to me, then we’re good.” But the problem was the minute I found out that she was telling this to everyone, it made me wonder who she is actually loyal to? And then beyond that point, she’s being very strategic, and she can toss you under the bus at any point. Speaking of loyalty, we have to talk about your decision in that antivirus chain. You end up saving Rachel, which seems to shock everyone, most notably the “throuple” in Bru and Alyssa. Then Alyssa ends up getting blocked. Talk me through everything that went behind that decision. So with Alyssa and Bru, I was feeling, “Oh, yay! I have them, and this is so sweet. They’re like my first Circle alliance.” And then I had Frank and Rachel, that I felt such a heart connection. These people just trust me for some reason. We just vibe so well. And when I was forced to show my hand, I was choosing between these two alliances. And in my head, I was like this, “Frank chose me. And the new players chose Frank. That’s three people that you’ll have on your bad side if you don’t choose the way he wants.” Thinking about Rachel, I got news from Alyssa earlier that Rachel and Nathan did not get along. At the moment, my knowledge was that Rachel knows Frank and me, and she’s had a girl chat with Alyssa and Carol. And in this antivirus game, in my mind, not only are you choosing who you want to say, but you’re also thinking, “Who was the person that just picked me wanting me to pick?” I knew Frank wanted me to pick Rachel. And it also would be in my best interest to choose Rachel, because she is not a fan of Nathan, so the next choice that she would make, in my head, is Alyssa. Little did I know, after seeing some of the episodes, that Rachel had a relationship with Nathan. So when she chose Nathan, I was confused. You’re only operating with whatever information you have. You forget that everyone else does not have the same information. So I wasn’t thinking of how attached Bru might have been to Carol. And so you’re like, “Okay, there are so many people left to choose. Alyssa is going to be one of them. Even if she hates me in this game, I know she’s going to get saved.” I was so confident. Because Carol’s a catfish, everyone hates Carol right now. So when it played out the way it did, I was stunned. I would say the most frustrating part is I know I got a lot of heat for it. But Bru and I both had the responsibility. If we’re going to blame me, we also have to talk about the fact that Bru had to choose between Carol and Alyssa as well. So, in the end, we only operated with whatever information we had. It did not go the way that I intended it to go. I really was trying to merge my throuple with Frank and Rachel. That was the plan, and then it didn’t happen. Shortly after that, you get this pretty defaming portrait of you made anonymously by Eversen. What was your reaction to that, considering what that might have said about how you were perceived after the antivirus blocking? The portrait made me ill. That was so ugly. It looks like a serial killer drew it. (Laughs.) It did give me a good laugh in the end. But I knew in my heart that if the majority of the players disliked me, that’s fine. So long as Frank and Rachel didn’t, that’s all that mattered. With the confidence and safety net that I felt with those two, I was like, “It’s fine. Whatever.” At that point, I couldn’t imagine Bru doing that because I felt like we really did make amends. And I did end up saving him prior to that actual challenge. So I really felt like I had fixed it. And I knew it was not Frank and Rachel. And I doubted it was any of the new players. So I was like, “Nathan might have been the one that did it.” But as long as I had my “Inner Trust Circle,” they really had my heart. You were able to open up on the show about embracing your Chinese heritage and your family’s story. What’s the reception been like from the fandom in response to that? It’s hard because you don’t always want to be like the spokesperson for your entire community. It’s such a wide community in general. But it’s also nice to have people who either relate or say, “I haven’t seen anyone who’s that short on TV. You’re so into fashion, you’re so into makeup, and you’re also loud and proud about your heritage.” That actually feels really good. Because typically, it’s very much like, “Oh, this person is Asian-American. They don’t talk too much about it.” Which is also totally fine. We’re also welcome to do that, not make our identity at the forefront of who we are. But I think it’s a huge part of me, which is why I’m so happy about that. So far, the reaction has been just very positive. Especially being able to say that I grew up in San Francisco and have a lot of my old friends say, “Yes, this is the experience that I also had. Or, “I didn’t have your experience, but it’s really nice to hear about that experience on a platform like Netflix.” It’s very heartwarming for sure. You spoke about wanting to bring all of yourself to The Circle. Did you learn anything about yourself in that process? They say it’s a social media experiment/competition. And that’s the thing about reality TV. I think it actually points a lot more to where we are culturally and socially. Social media has taken the world by storm. And I think that’s it’s actually such an interesting “critique” that exposes a bit about social media at large. I’ve always navigated that fine line of, “Where does my digital me start and end? How much of it is me online versus not?” That first conversation really woke me up when people said, “Yu Ling, you’re so quiet. Yet you’re this big personality.” It taught me that sometimes, what you see is not all the full story. And also what you put out there is open for anyone to interpret any way they want. What you do, behind the screen, there’s so much more going on that you simply do not see. But then you get whatever’s on the screen, and you fully operate off of those interpretations. So funny enough, I feel like coming out of The Circle, I’ve started a journey of remembering to not let other people’s interpretation of what I’m putting out there color the way I choose to show up. Next, check out our interview with Trevor St. Agathe, AKA “Imani”, the runner-up of The Circle season 4, as well as his wife season 2 winner DeLeesa St. Agathe.
